Finding Talismans

I’ve been reading some frustrated messages in the Discord about finding the rarest of the talismans. Or being unable to find them as the case may be. They are end game items and stacking loot bonus helps but I’ve heard quite a few times that people wish there was a way to earn most of them rather than grind loot and pray.

Here’s some suggestions but basically, you could award a lot of talismans based on what they do, or what just fits flavor wise.

Aid of Umaro - awarded for first Itherian realm clear. Awarded by Umaro himself. (We’d probably need the awakened artifact update for this to make sense.)
Then… Grim Dawn - awarded for grinding X spell gems
Angela’s Immortality - awarded for transmuting X materials
Brode’s Last Laugh - awarded for finding X cards
Gambler’s Fortune - awarded for winning X games against each gambling dwarf
Ianne’s Left Eye - awarded for reforging stats X times
Ianne’s Right Eye - awarded for picking up floor spawn legendary material boxes X times
Kalzor’s Gambit - awarded for salvaging artifacts X times
Scavenger’s Sorrow - … same as now, found randomly in treasure
Thylacine’s Legacy - awarded for reaching mage level X
Zack’s Trinket - awarded for killing your first treasure golem, found mysteriously after the “most dramatic” message

I actually prefer the way they are now, having really rare items in normal loot is exciting.

That’s pretty much the whole point of talismans. They’re meant to be ultra rare items that you get excited about once you finally find one. They aren’t necessary to play the game and are just nice bonuses to have, and tons of talismans can already be obtained from the gods already.

If I might chip in, my point of view on this matter is that having multiple routes to the same difficult-to-obtain goal is a good design choice. “Have it happen on its own as a surprise” is a certainly valid style of play, but so is the more goal-driven method laid out here. If you were to take both options simultaneously and have talismans be both a reward for specific challenges AND be obtainable just as a random rare drop, it would allow more players to play the game the way they want to. A better experience for everyone. :smiley:

Really the only “non-valid” way to play the game as such is cheating, and that’s purely because there’s a competitive/balance aspect involved.

Would also like to +1 the rng. I like the idea of rewards for achievements. But not talismans. They will come in due time but knocking out the achievements can pretty much be done in a couple days.

The alternate methods of obtaining talismans to me seems a bit too easy. Just repeating a single task to get an item seems to not only make getting it a chore but also diminishes the value and feeling of achievement when you do get it. I myself have only found 4 Talismans and i’m currently at 377 hours. Let’s say 77 hours i may have been idling the game a bit but even at 300 hours that’s 75 hours/item. Maybe i’m having bad luck but this seems like a bit of a long time. As for the idea of if they should be made easier to get i’m torn. If i find a Talisman that’s a massive drop for me. It will be a huge moment even if it’s not a talisman i particularity want. If he was to do something it might be to do something similar to the nether bosses where if you continuously open chests without finding one it will increase the chances for one to drop. But then again would this reduce the joy people get when finding them?

My own idea might be to have a talisman that increases your chances of finding a talisman. This one would replace the one you get for completing your first Itherian realm. The current drop rate on talismans is quite small so even if you upgraded it to 100% that would only double a small chance…which i think is perfectly fine. If my hours are correct, getting it to 100 would drop the time required to find a talisman from 75 to 37.5 hours…increase it to 200% and it would be 25…Getting the talisman to these levels would require quite a bit of levels and work but that seems to be in the spirit of the game.

I dunno, I honestly didn’t really feel much excitement or accomplishment or whatever when I got the talismans. I was after Brode’s for the longest time and it was one of the last to drop, but I wanted it specifically for a game plan i’d come up with but couldn’t execute efficiently without the talisman. I mostly just felt exasperation that I was entirely at the whim of RNG to get it, then mostly just felt “now I can get started” when I did get it.

I completely see your point!

My biggest argument with that is that you wouldn’t have even know that talisman exists if it wasn’t for Discord, forums, wikis, etc. I know people are going to use those resources and I actively support them, but at the same time, I don’t think it makes sense for me to balance the game around their existence.

That’s what I was getting at when I brought up the whole “multiple ways to play” thing. =v
I see tons of achievements, especially high-end ones like “get 700 cards” and I see it as a goal to actively work at rather than a milestone that’ll happen on its own. By the same token I absolutely feel the approach of people who play it differently than I do is just as valid.

You’re right on the money about how i’d likely not have even known about them without outside knowledge, but then i’d have just likely worked at the cards all the same with far less efficiency and more frustration, and then been like “wait, i’ve been wasting a ton of time I didn’t have to??” if I was surprised by the Brode drop.

Admittedly my approach to things probably isn’t representative of most folks though, so take it with a grain of salt. :wink:

Alright, so the official stance on finding talismans is that they are meant to be ultra rare RNG items. However, could they still remain RNG to obtain in loot, but with a slight modification. Like if a person plays the game for X hours and kills Y number of monsters that they have an increasing chance to get the talismans as drops. Because, it is statistically possible to be that one person who plays the game forever, but never finds all those rare items even after 500+ hours of gameplay.

For example, I have played this game a lot more because I wanted to rank up my talismans, but if I never got some of the random drop talismans like “Scavenger’s Sorrow”, “Zack’s Trinket”, the material increasing talismans, then I would have probably had less interest in Itherian realms and grinding talisman levels. I would probably become really frustrated if I played for a long time and missed stuff in the game due to bad luck. So, implementation of some kind of increasing chance to obtain items that make players want to play more is in one way like setting a limit to the bad luck a player should have with random drop items. Sort of like how sigils have a higher tendency to drop when you have few of them. Otherwise, people wouldn’t do itherian realms as much and they would be missing out on part of the game.

Just my two brimstone, now that I’m in post-game.

I think some kind of increasing percentile seems fine; I don’t care about achievements, items, or finding everything, but I view this as my ‘beer n’ chips’ game; something to relax to.
Most of the people I know off-line who play games like this, though, they’d be obsessed with 100%-ing it, and probably a bit frustrated that there’s no way to guarantee an eventual drop.
But I do feel like talismans are a very esoteric, ‘ah, neat!’ kind of thing; and I’ve got no idea on how to keep that element of discovery while still allowing for players to either guarantee, or increase their chances of finding them.

But I do like Scholek’s idea of a playtime/critters-ded counter. Sure, somebody could hack the gibson and alter those values, but it’d still offer people an option. That way, whether hunting for a specific talisman for their playstyle, grinding, or whatnot, nobody is going to feel like the odds are too terribly stacked against them. If you end up revisiting the ideas of Gringar and gay monster dad, I’ve got a suggestion for that, too - and I’ll let it sum up my thoughts.

Have rare talisman percentile chance/achivements that unlock talismans/long quests that unlock specific talismans become available on NG+.

The rarer talismans could be locked behind several loops, like a certain other series, ahaha - but I feel like this’d satisfy both those who don’t really mind if they never see a rare talisman in their life, and those who want a sure route to achieving talismans other than ‘roll the dice and pray!’ It’d also give a good motivation to try a second cycle, I think.