I think Woe should be changed/nerfed.

Whether it’s overpowered or not, I just don’t think it’s that interesting. Get a monster with HUGE HP, kill it, nuke all monsters, rinse/repeat. Sure, it’s not godlike infinite depth powerful, but mechanically, it’s just sort of dull. It ignores defense, enemy type, and deals huge damage – to everything. I just don’t see any reason to try anything else. Why worry about anything else when you can just stack huge HP and blow everything up in one turn. Even if half my team is dead, it doesn’t matter so long as I get my HP bomb dude dead first.

Character stats, class strengths/weaknesses, healing, defenses… I don’t really think about any of this anymore. I just wait to hit my Nuke and collect loot. (Okay, I think about some defense.)

I don’t feel like my team is working together as with other traits, they all just faff about while waiting for my HP nuke to go off. Yes, they do contribute to boosting the HP nuke, but bleh, six monster party… only one of them seems to matter.

inb4: Just don’t use it. LOL

I don’t have an actual opinion on this, but the way you’ve described it is hilarious.

I like how you say “inb4: Just don’t use it” as though that were a bad argument. This is a SINGLE-player game. It’s fine if you don’t want to use overpowered combinations, but why annoy people who don’t mind or who do want to?

Not to get sidetracked here (though it is sorta still about the topic) I’d say the single-player don’t balance the game argument is a really bad one for about a million reasons obvious to anyone who stopped to think about it for longer than it takes to type, “But it’s a single-player game.”

Gameplay balance is not the same thing as what you are saying. Your argument is simply “I don’t want to play that combo, so it shouldn’t be the optimal one so I don’t feel bad not using it”.

Woe’s base damage is in line with other AoE abilities. For example AoE spells like Blistering Radiance or Volcano that deal “large” amount of damage deal damage equal to 160% of your intelligence.
Assuming we have a creature with attack/int/speed/def being equal and twice that amount in health.
Spell damage for a “large damage” AoE spell is 1.6Int-Def =1.6x-x = 0.6x. Spell casts to kill a creature is 4 (creature has 2x health)
Woe damage is 0.4
Health = 0.42x = 0.8*x. Woes to kill a creature is 3 (well not really surprising considering it is 40% Maximum Health :wink: )

The main reason why Woe appears to be very powerful is the fact that it is not affected by enemy creatures stats (defense).
This means it only scales based on the stats of your creatures which makes Woe better when fighting higher level teams.
The number of spell casts needed to kill an enemy team goes to infinity after the enemies defense exceeds 160% of your creature’s intelligence. The number of Woes needed to kill an enemy will always be finite.

The fix would be to increase Woes damage to 90% Maximum Health but let it be affected by defense. This would keep the baseline damage between Woe and spells intact while giving Woe similar scaling to spells.

My woe-based team definitely peters out at higher realm levels, and is no infinite build.

[quote=“Ignatius, post:1, topic:2134”]Whether it’s overpowered or not, I just don’t think it’s that interesting. Get a monster with HUGE HP, kill it, nuke all monsters, rinse/repeat. Sure, it’s not godlike infinite depth powerful, but mechanically, it’s just sort of dull. It ignores defense, enemy type, and deals huge damage – to everything. I just don’t see any reason to try anything else. Why worry about anything else when you can just stack huge HP and blow everything up in one turn. Even if half my team is dead, it doesn’t matter so long as I get my HP bomb dude dead first.

Character stats, class strengths/weaknesses, healing, defenses… I don’t really think about any of this anymore. I just wait to hit my Nuke and collect loot. (Okay, I think about some defense.)

I don’t feel like my team is working together as with other traits, they all just faff about while waiting for my HP nuke to go off. Yes, they do contribute to boosting the HP nuke, but bleh, six monster party… only one of them seems to matter.

inb4: Just don’t use it. LOL[/quote]

If u test it under 100 lvl realm and it works, i have a bad news for u, my friend.

wouldn’t mouth of hell/final oblation’s 200% hp on provoke be far superior to 40%?

Mouth of Hell’s trait deals 0 damage at full health.

[quote=“Umaro, post:10, topic:2134”]

Mouth of Hell’s trait deals 0 damage at full health.[/quote]

that’s why then! ;D

I have not found an equivalent to Dark Dance, which makes Woe proc twice. You can also trigger Woe by casting Sudden Death, so it has better synergy than Final Oblation.

there is a moon dance for provoke skills twice

Hm, well I gave it some thought, and based on all the monsters and traits I need in my party just to make this thing work for me, I suppose it’s not so bad, it’s just very limited game play. (I guess I just miss having to think about which enemy attacks what, but that’s something I could always go back to with most any other team…) I guess I brought this on my self.

Kejal has the right idea when it comes to balancing the nuts and bolts of it. If Zack thought it were necessary.