Just so it's here too: Full blind accessibility checklist

  1. Walking noises so blind people can tell where they are: Done

  2. Bump noises so blind people can tell where they are accurately: Done

Example: 1 sound, 3 pitches
Low for permanent walls
Medium for interactables (trash, chests, etc.)
High for NPCs, alters, and so on

  1. Full text narration (NVDA support? TTS reader? API addition?) so blind people won’t have to use OCR to play the game: Not done yet (might not be possible given budget but I thought I’d include it.)

Don’t forget, I know of at least two blind people who, without my asking them to, bought into Siralim Ultimate’s kickstarter so I really want to make sure they can play as well as anyone.

Don’t forget. That’s all I ask. Don’t forget about us.

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Yep, this is still on the to-do list! Thanks!

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Oh thank god! Let me know when it’s coming up and I’ll get in touch with my blind friends to hopefully find out exactly how best to convey said information.

I’m positive there’s got to be a way to add some kind of mode or mod or something to allow access to screen readers. What engine is Siralim Ultimate made in? I know some folks I can ask about this if it’s a common engine.

It’s made with GameMaker 2.

https://docs.yoyogames.com/source/dadiospice/001_advanced%20use/extensions/using%20extensions.html

https://twitter.com/ianhamilton_/status/1024902226660212736

From the two people I was able to get a hold of. First two are from a blind programmer who’s currently working on a slay the spire more called Say the Spire for blind people (I’m doing the descriptions for it)

The latter is from the big cheese himself, Ian Hamilton.

To be honest, you will probably need to rely on a third party solution for OCR. This would be a massive undertaking that I don’t have the resources to handle. The other suggestions you made will be added, though.

I knew it was a long shot but you won’t know unless you try, right? :stuck_out_tongue: OCR will make it slow going but the rest of it (sound stuff) will make it possible. Blind people play ASCII roguelikes. Not these blind people but some blind people do. I don’t know how a person can have that kind of patience (having to look around tile by tile every single turn.) So something like Siralim with the sounds of walking and bonking will be lightspeed compared to that. :stuck_out_tongue:

And when the bonk sounds make it in to round out the audio navigation, you can bet your ass I’ll be bugging them to stream it because “can be played by blind people (link to video)” is a damn good PR trick and you can bet I, and by association they, will be sending the Siralim name out far and wide.

Edit: Buddy of mine brought up a good point. Sounds for roaming monsters. Even though they’re “hold A to kill” XP grinders, he’s right that they ought to make a sound. Deeper walking sound maybe?

An update, Zack.

12:37 PM ] superblindman :

OK, here’s my initial report. Started the game just fine. The game reads relatively well, but not perfectly, as expected. The weird thing is the errors it makes are consistent. Like, most F’s are turned into P’s. This tells me that it’s a font issue, and were it not for that the game would read almost perfectly. I was able to begin the game, and set the options as well. The training battle went OK except that I can’t find an accessible way to know your or your enemy’s health. I now have enough mana to summon a new creature, but am struggling to find the summoning brazier. However, my struggles aren’t without some success. The layout, at least of this opening room, appears to be simple enough that I might be able to find it eventually or with guideance, and then possibly even memorize where it is for future reference. Things appear to be located in little alcoves or along coridors, which is good. I just haven’t happened to find it yet.

[ 12:39 PM ] Blind Ryan :

Cool. I’ll let them know. To explain the health thing, you unlock that as you fight more of the same monster type.

[ 12:39 PM ] superblindman :

Well sure, but what about your own health? That should be available always, right?

[ 12:40 PM ] Blind Ryan :

That should be…

[ 12:40 PM ] superblindman :

Yeah, so that doesn’t appear to read then.

[ 12:40 PM ] Blind Ryan :

Let me see here.

[ 12:40 PM ] Blind Ryan :

It should be in the health bars at the bottom of the screen.

[ 12:41 PM ] superblindman :

If they’re bars, that would explain it, but I found nothing that seems to indicate health that was read by OCR.

[ 12:41 PM ] superblindman :

Also I forgot to mention this but the post-battle screen is confusing as heck. Haha.

[ 12:42 PM ] Blind Ryan :

Oh that? You get your various XP gains and then you get items to be gained when you exit a floor.

[ 12:43 PM ] superblindman :

I don’t mind the font issue in general. I feel I understood events very well, and all the hilarity that came with them. Haha.

[ 12:43 PM ] Blind Ryan :

Yeah, in the health bar. Thought so.

Sooo… maybe a “screen reader friendly” option to normalize the font and/or remove the color from the health bars so screen readers can pick up the HP numbers?

Stirlock, another blind guy (who bought in yesterday on one of my streams,) had this idea. Is it doable, do you think? As a toggleable option maybe?

“I just thought of something that could change everything. If we can get all incoming text to copy to the clipboard, we will have a fully voiced game here.”

A few things could be copied to the clipboard, but unfortunately, anything related to the user interface wouldn’t be possible so I’m not sure how useful that would be.

I guess it’d depend on what a pain in the ass it would be. Maybe a copy panel text to clipboard hotkey? Maybe that third button? I know it’d be helpful in speeding up story reading.

From Superblindman:

Yeah, honestly if dialog and story stuff could be copied to the clipboard automatically with, say, a setting that one could activate, then we could use a clipboard reading tool to basically read the story immediately as we advance, no scanning required. It’d still be something.

Greetings Zach and friends!
I am finally here, on the forum, to speak for myself. I have just recently done my very first stream of Siralim Ultimate, which can be found here. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/732280299
There are absolutely great things about the game, even as a blind gamer. The simplicity of the UI, the menu structure functioning the way it does, all that is great. Some of the ways things could improve from a blind accessibility perspective have already been mentioned here, but I would like to throw in a few extra notes.
1: While different “bonk” sounds for NPC’s and/or interactables would be fine, audio beacons for such things would technically be better. I have heard there are restrictions with GM2 on stereo panning, so this may not technically be possible since a beacon only works if we can hear which direction it’s coming from, but I believe in providing as many solutions as possible.
2: There is a trick used in a few audio games that I think would work absolute wonders for this one. It’s a navigational aid referred to as wall tones. Essentially, using an unobtrusive sound, you identify walls or solid, noninteractable objects we must navigate around. This can be done without the need for stereo panning, as you only need to identify whether a wall is in front of or behind us, or to the left or right. If we can track walls, we can thereby also track openings, turns, corridor entrances, and so on. It would make wandering through the realm maps very slightly less wandery. If you’d like an example of this, in case I haven’t been clear enough, there is a game called Manamon, (essentially the Pokemon of audio games), which can be played in demo mode. That game and its sequel can be found on www.vgstorm.com
Or, even if you don’t want to download the demo, you can find coverage of both Manamon games on my Youtube channel: www.youtube.com/superblindman
Both use this wall tone trick for navigation, though both are also only audio, so either way, you will have to get your examples of what I mean without being able to see anything. Still, I wanted to bring up this idea because it would be remarkably valuable to us.

Lastly, I just want to say that, speaking of myself here, I don’t approach any of this from a place of negativity. I don’t want you, Zach, to think we’re in any way hating on your work, or are angry that it’s not instantaneously fully accessible or something. I’m doing this because I would genuinely like to help. If none of it works out, then hey at least we can basically play the game, if a little slowly. However if I can convince you to consider all this, and at least give it some rented space in your head, then I will be satisfied. And hey, if you do try a few things, trust that myself and others will be here to evaluate them, and we will continue to remain helpful all the while.
Oh, and if you need a case for that simpler font, seriously check out the archive of my stream I posted in the beginning of this reply. The mistakes OCR makes are kind of hilarious, yet it would also be just grand if it didn’t make them. Best example, according to OCR I am playing as the “honk” class. :slight_smile:
Again, thanks for any consideration, and thanks as well for what you have done so far. Your work is sincerely appreciated.

Thanks for the continued feedback on this!

Truthfully, as a fan of yours since Siralim 2 came out on Steam way back when, I’m legit curious what you’ll be able to use from all this feedback. I dig that GM2 is kind of a bitch to work with but I know how much you love your Siralim baby and I can only imagine what a trip it is to see fully blind people enjoying your game.

So I wanna see where this goes. Hopefully good, considering SU’s in alpha as opposed to out for 5 years. Room to improve… well, everything from the bottom up and the top down, right?