Skeleton Marksman and Wicked Carver [COMPLAINT, Bug?]

ver 0.10

Okay, I gotta complain about these guys’ traits again
Lone Wolf on
Me: Single creature
I’m about the same level (60ish) as what I’m fighting

Wicked Carver one shots my creature hitting for over 900 HP of damage in a fight.
There’s no way with the damage reduction from Lone Wolf this thing should be hitting for that much. Stronger creatures than Carver are hitting Wolper for the 20-30 range (Yeti, Troll, Smog, Giants, etc).

I think they are multiplying their attack rather than the damage as the trait states. Only explanation I can come up with.

800 attack * 300% = 2400 - 500 (my defense) = 1900 damage * .4 (Lone Wolf) = 760 damage
Only way I can see it, and even then it was STILL more damage than this.

What it should be is:
800 attack - 500 (my defense) = 300 damage * .4 * 300% = 360 damage

As the trait reads, it should be multiplying the damage (after the addition/subtraction) rather than the attack.
I suspect Skeleton Marksman to be pulling the same shenanigans. Something is just fishy.

There are other explanations, for example the enemy Carver could have had a Lance artifact. With one or two attack enchants it would allow it to do that amount of damage.

Or maybe it could it just happens to have a high attack. I once met a worm that deals 10% of its attack on my turn. Normally it ok but this time it kills each of my creatures as they take their turn, meaning it has 10 times more attack than i had health.

I estimated 800 attack, which is already very high for a creature of that level. Creatures get (level / 5) * 100% of base stat growth. In the 60 range, this should put it at about 250 range. With a sword artifact and tons of attack enchants, it might hit 800. Maybe. I suspect it is lower and there’s wonky math with how the trait calculates.

True, but Carvers and Marksman have been a complaint of mine well before Lance artifacts were even introduced. Literally my first experience, day 1, first encounter was a Marksman one-shotting my team @ lv 1. It hit for damage in the 80 range at lv 1… which it shouldn’t have ANY artifacts at realm lv 1. And I arrive at the same explanation: it must be multiplying attack values rather than damage values. Mathematical order of operations does matter and makes a difference.

It the trait is supposed to multiply attack, fine, change the description.

But Marksmen deal very little damage to Sand Giants, for example.

These traits are definitely working correctly, and multiply damage, not attack.

Which proves my point.
As the attack vs defense comparison between the two creatures diminishes, so does their damage.
As the attack vs defense comparison gap increases, their damage multiplies by a massive factor.

This points to the attack stat being multiplied rather than the post attack vs defense damage calculation. Attack vs Defense is a linear measurement in Siralim, A - B = Damage. When you put in 4A - B = Damage, it grows very fast. The way it should be is A - B = 4Damage.

In the case of a Carver, he can have a 4x multiplier on his attack (not damage). While a normal creature is hitting in the 20-30 range, Carver can spike to 300-400 (or more) because of the attack being multiplied rather than the damage itself. The expected outcome would be damage (at maximum) would be in the 100-140 range.

Same thing w/Sniper. Here’s real numbers @ lv 1:
Skeleton Sniper has 22 attack

Here’s Wolper and Sand Giant

 	HP 	MA 	Att 	Int 	Def 	Spd
Wolper	27	22	22	17	7	22
Giant	37	20	25	5	25	5

Wolper should take 22 attack - 7 defense = ~10-15 base damage. Even if you multiply that by the 125% more damage (which is 225% of base damage), you should only get ~20-30 damage.
And yes, there will be some +/- variation in there, but it should not be in the “I do double your HP in damage” range.

Giant would take an expected less than 5 damage (if any at all).
But in actuality, when the Sniper’s perk triggers, Giant magically takes 15-20.

You can test this @ lv 1 (where no artifacts are supposed to be in play? I think?)
The only explanation I can surmise is that the 22 Attack gets multiplied by the trait (225%) resulting in ~50 attack. Thus you get the larger swings in damage output.

Carver has the same story.

If I’m wrong, so be it. I can’t see the code. I just see the massive damage swings, and it smells fishy.

And here’s the answer. I’ll just shut up now and take my Carver damage like a man. Thank you for checking this, Zack!